Remember, remember the 3rd of February. Yes, yes. And can I be honest with you? Please. I've been a bit worried about the 3rd of February. Yes, you could say you've been anxious. I could say I've been anxious. And today I'm going to talk about your anxiety. My anxiety? Yes, that's the theme of today. From our old friend, Epic Teaters, easy for you to say. Easy for me to say. When I see an anxious person, I ask myself, what do they want? For a person wasn't wanting something outside of their control.

Why would they be so stricken by anxiety? there's loads we could get into. I used to work with a guy and I remember he turned to me one day and he just went, I feel anxious and I don't know why. And I went, that's anxiety. That is literally anxiety. So let's talk about anxiety in the workplace. I think over the last 10, 15 years, it's a common conversation like anxiety.

20 years ago, I didn't even know it was a word. didn't know people were talking about it, but the Stoics obviously knew about it. So let's talk about how that can present in the workplace. Yeah, I think I have, it's a very oversimplified thing, but often the root cause of anxiety is too many options. I'm overstimulated with potential options and outcomes and it's overwhelming me. And then something that's on the other side, maybe more like a, like a depression or a sadness.

comes and feel like you have no options. So they're two extremes and on your system, it feels extreme to have that. So perhaps in a sales setting, it could be, I've got the target. I've got an idea, a story, I'm telling myself that my manager is unhappy with me. I also don't really understand the product. I don't really understand why my numbers are behind. I don't really know what I'm doing with my life.

I'm worried about telling my parents what I do or my grandmother at the family barbecue because I think they're going to look down on me. And suddenly you've got all these different angles of your life that are closing on you. Yeah. You've alluded to a few things there and I think this is a really interesting point, but you're speaking about my manager. don't know if he's happy. My parent. I feel like I've done a bit of reading into this, but all problems are interpersonal problems. So a lot of the problems that you will face in life are because of people and things like that that happen. you never have, you might have a problem with a microphone, but that's probably not a big worry. But what it usually feels like with anxiety for me and other people that I've spoken to is it's a conversation that hasn't happened yet. A conversation that you probably need to have. So if I'm having anxiety around a certain client or a certain deal,

It's probably because there's a conversation to be had that may be awkward. There's maybe some things to get on the table. Like you said, they're with the manager. There's probably some difficult questions. And we know that actually, if you want an easy life, you have to do the hard things. One of the things I've found in life is having difficult conversations really gets you out of those anxiety kind of situation. So we've had it a lot and we kind of.

set ground rules. Obviously, running a business together, we've set rules on how we communicate and the way we have those conversations, which alleviates a lot of those anxiety thoughts because we kind of know how each other are thinking. So what advice would you give to people that maybe have to have a difficult conversation to relieve that anxiety? might they be having it with? Give me some context. Let's say salesperson and direct line manager or CEO. There's something going on. We know that

CEOs sometimes are difficult to manage and they'll say, want you to focus on this one day and then they'll change scope the next day. And it can be quite frustrating for a salesperson that wants to go out there and catch fish. Yeah. So there's a technique called the accusation audit. So if I was to, if I was to come to you with bad news, Jack, right. So it's like business bad news. I'm coming to you. I'd say.

I've got something really bad to tell you. You're going to hate me. You're going to think the worst of me. You're going to think I've really, really dropped the ball on this. And you maybe might even not want to speak to me again after you find out what it is. Where does your brain go to there? I'm probably a little bit worried, but then I'm like, yeah, what's happening? What have you done? It sounds awful. goes exactly. It goes to the absolute worst, the most awful thing I could say. And then when I say I've got this feeling that because I'm falling behind a bit that maybe I'm going to lose my job or I'm going to, I don't know. It's just, it's just playing on my mind. I'm really sorry to bring it up. No, that's irrational. You're not going to lose your job just because you're falling behind. Obviously I'm going to work with you to get there. Exactly. Exactly. So accusation is just getting everything out on the table first, getting in front with things. I'd also say with anxiety in, in the, in the modern world, we often invite anxiety into our lives without realizing it. So I was talking to a lad the other day in my office that was saying,

He was feeling a bit anxious and, um, you know, he's like, don't really know why I can't think what's different. And I was chatting to him in the kitchen and he's making himself a coffee thinking it's about half 11. I've definitely seen you make it. How many coffees do you have in the morning? He's like, this is my third one for three coffees. There's no one. So often we invite into our, into our lives without realizing, I think another big thing is, the phone. Um, especially everything's down to shorter form content now, isn't it?

And I think we're all guilty of it. I'm certainly not immune to it. If you might find a video you like and the next thing you flick through and you doom scrolling and we went away, didn't we, with children and partners with, a few of our friends. I thought, you know what? I'm going to leave my phone at home. away for four days. Let's just see what happens. You're reaching for it a bit, but then by the second day is you're thinking, I don't feel any, does none of that like overstimulated thing in my body. I'm not feeling like.

eager or urgent or that early sign of any anxiety is gone. So often we need to look at our lives and say, well, what are those other areas where I'm invited in and how do I limit those? If I can't limit the other things, if there definitely is pressure at work and I can't do anything about it, well, maybe a bit less caffeine, time on the phone might just counterbalance it. But you're so right. So when you're busy, usually, I don't know if you find this, but it usually hits me when my head hits the pillow.

You know what mean? So you're busy all day. It's like busy, busy. I'm in meetings. I'm managing a team, doing all these sales calls. Then I go home. There's a baby. There's a partner you're eating. You might watch a bit of TV. You're on your phone. The phone goes off. Your head hits a pillow and you go, right. And then all of those thoughts of like things you've got to deal with, awkward conversations you've got to have tomorrow. That's when it hits you. But one of the things I say is like we've said in previous episodes, it's addictive sometimes. But you can't do anything in that moment. So then you build that anxiety of what's going to happen. You play out situations that might not happen. We know Seneca talks about that a lot. The hack that I say is anything that comes into your mind, the best thing to do is write it down and maybe try and move away from like a phone or notes because maybe keep like a little notepad or a pen and you just write down those thoughts like I'm taking them out and placing them on a metaphorical table. And I'll deal with that first thing in the morning.

Once I've done my morning ritual or whatever, I'm going to put that on the table. I'm going to deal with it then because right now this isn't helping me. I can't deal with it and I can't like move forward. What I need to do is recoup and sleep and rest and I'll deal with that another day. That's a really good technique, but I'm mad you've never told it to me before. Well, you know it now and I've shared it with the world. I've been Jack Frimston. I've been Zach Thompson. Remember you will die. Defrost that chicken, Debbie.